Global warming. what do you think we should do?

Harry, I agree with you on the judging part.

BUT if we do not need to care about if it is good science or not we can stop discussing these things right away! I have no problems to claim whatever BUT if I can not support my claims with trustworthy facts (read peer-reviewed facts, e.i. not New York Times...) they mean NOTHING!

 

Did I miss something? I did not see the Times referred to anywhere. I'm not sure but I don't think this was intended to be a peer reviewed article. But I think maybe the referred documents are. I don't have access to them though. Have you read it yet Magnus?

I'm not sure any of us only depend on peer reviewed 'facts' when making our decision regardless of our point of view. Facts are sometimes hard to come by but data is not. That's why intelligent people can infer different points of view using the same data. So, where are the 'facts'. Just because something is reviewed by peers does not make it so and therefore does not mean it's a fact.

I believe both sides of this discussion sometimes mix up their opinion with facts. Just because someones opinion may be different than your own does not make them wrong or right.

As for this gentleman, I agree with his analysis. I do believe that the earth is warming and the last decade has been the warmest for the globe. I also believe people with use small snippets of data out of context to prove a point. It happens all the time and that's what this paper seems to be about.

 

Its a great topic to create one track thinking and research forgotten and a chance to jump on a "band wagon"[/QUOTE]

And, I assume your thinking isn't one track?[/QUOTE]
I try to think as best as possible, both ways, its when the debate is hijacked by the ONE TRACKERS and refuse to add anything to the debate other than "what the scientists" say. They have no knowledge of the subject except for what they want to believe. I will accept anything as fact provided the logic is fair and reasonable. There have been many televised debates here with the "experts" but when they are asked questions regarding their theories/findings against geological research that does pose some doubt on their findings they use the "Skeptic" line and close down the discussion.

 

While you are babbling away if it is one way or another, the climate get one step closer to collaps. So stop babbling and do something creative instead.

 

Sorry, we'll all go out and close the countries we live in down and go back to living in caves again.
Ok, what are your suggestions for this creative stuff that will not cost you your bank balance, basic life comforts, food supply and variety, transportation, building materials.

 

change is always occuring
our time here is short just like our memories
we have come a long way in the last 10k years
arrogant of us to think we are that powerful to be responsible for ALL CHANGES on this big spinning orb.
we do what we can do while we can do it, then we DIE and it is no longer our issue.
science rocks but it can be manipulated to SAY what one wants it to say, if that person or group has an agenda.
I decided to leave where i grew up because of a huge snow storm, and damned if i make a quick visit and spend an xtra 4 days stuck here shoveling 2 feet of snow.
. what comes around goes around and then comes back around to kick us in the arse.
good lord humans are arrogant
one big volcanic boom or asteroid and those left will be living in caves and you know what, the one's of us that are dead won't care cuz we won't know. we will be fertilizer.

off my soapbox... oh yeah HUGZ for all :>)

 

Well said ! The global "warming" has really worked in reducing the snow storms in the eastern USA hasn't it ???

 

We have had many 100 year events in my area in the last 20 years but these will always occur and should not be seen as proof to either side of this argument. I would say in general our winters have been milder but this is a non scientific observation and proves nothing. I really don;t think we would have to spend much more money than we already are, just redirect it. Quit subsidizing large corporations would be a start. Our 'free market' is really not so free except for the really little guys. The big guys constantly manipulate the system and Oil and Coal is great at it.

I read an article about a year ago about a community reactor that would be buried and would run for 100 years (I may be remembering this wrong). Once the fuel was used up it would be left in place and we may actually have better technology in place by that time. Seems like Toshiba was going to make these. Sounded intriguing to me.

 

Why yes, it HAS.
When I was a kid, I always heard stories of people driving horse drawn sleighs
across the north channel of Jamaica Bay in New York City up until the 1920's.

This is a body of salt water, so it had to get pretty cold for that, even if it was for perhaps one month a year.

This kind of freeze has not happened in my lifetime.

 

monster dumps of snow and constant cold that it takes to freeze moving fresh or salt water really do not have to go hand n hand.

i am thinking the lack of Sun Spot activity plays a bigger role in all the whoha than a few ppm more CO2....

 

No wonder that USA dont sign any climate treatys!

Well, You sure think as a cave man.

 

Fungus, Roy is from Australia but I suspect the US will sign on for what it's worth this time. We have been in the dark ages of environmental causes for the past 8 years.

 

True, volcanic activity and solar storms could do more than we mere earthlings could ever envision, but that is out of our control. But we can control pollutants and emissions. If there is a catastrophic eruption of a long dead volcano,-Yellowstone comes to mind- we are toast and that is that.
But if that next major geological disturbance is still thousands of years off, don't we owe it to the up coming generations to provide them as stable a world as we inherited?
... But there are 6.7BILLION of us!

Remember that old joke about if everyone in the U.S. jumped up and down at exactly the same time on the same day that California would fall into the Pacific? If all 6.7 BILLION of us exhaled at the same moment, the CO2 levels would certainly spike!

The mere population of the planet is unprecedented. The higher Co2 levels are great for orchids, but not so great for glaciers, lowland areas etc.

 

I personally believe that most people that want to do nothing take that position because they do not want to change anything they are doing now. I think that we talk about how much money it will cost but have no problem spending 1 trillion dollars on a war. I think that if business decides to lay off all their employees because their profit margin is too low it's OK but if it's to do something that benefits anything else it's a tragedy. These arguments ring very hollow to me.

 

Fungas, you don't indicate where you live which is interesting but the fact remains as has been posted, we can control pollution and environmental degredation which is a must, I totally agree. International treaties mean NOTHING unless the 198 countries or so, sign up to it. THEY WON'T. Its up to individual countries to overhaul their own patch.
Not all the climate changes can be pointed at the human race, its called NATURE, we have the ability to do something though. Your attitude is reflective of so many that scream and yell but have no genuine intellect to add any solutions to the problem, except to dismantle life as we know it.
Harry noted that they have been in the dark ages of environmental causes for 8 years, I suggest the world has been in it for a lot longer.
Again as has been mentioned, we can do something to reduce potential or actual environmental issues but under the guide lines as wanted by the screamers and yellers like yourself, half the population of the world would starve to death. Hey, maybe you solved the problem.

 

and if every cow,rhino,elephant et al farted - shit and burped at the same time ..lord have mercy Fairbanks might become tropical again !? come on dude, like the planet was in so much better shape a generation age...hell no it is better now, there are just more humans. there probably is a finite amount of carbon or whateve,r so populations of creatures on this planet ebb and flo , be it lions, ungulates in giant herds , humans ..

actually , religious fundamentalism of any and all flavors is more of a pressing concern than some ppm of this and that.
the US except Al Gore does not really care, because, maybe our dumb asses see it as not in the top 10 of bothers to fret over ?

if we all do our "part" it adds up, but to have BIG GOVT regulate something more or less unregulatable...just costs my poor ass more $$ that i do not have...
i am now going back to fretting over my orchids, i am finally back home after being stuck in Virginina - which by the way gets a dump of snow like that about every 15 to 20 years.

 

I'm in the US and I care and I know plenty of people who care and I'm in one of the most conservative areas of the country. I beg to differ on the snow storm. In Washington at least it's the largest on record and they go back to 1835. Happy you got home but I think you should walk next time instead of using all that BIG GOVT regulated stuff like highways and airways.

 

harry i grew up there (poor me) and what i heard and read was 6th largest snow storm in recorded history , though largest dump in December
but i am not going to argue over that.
I do care and i do, do what i can but i refuse to have more and more silly willynilly crap regulated, especially when WE really do not know if those things really will make a difference. People at all levels should respect the earth so the best possible future can be here for those who come later.
i do think all GOVT efforts worldwide should be put into Renewables - WIND - SOLAR - HYDRO etc.. pronto lickety split...not wasting O2 on Carbon Credit regulations and other such aspects.

 

I stand corrected. It was the largest for the month. I totally agree and I'm not a fan of cap and trade since it will be manipulated by the same folks that gave us the mess that we are still struggling to exit from.

We are on the same page.